Strategies for Changing Hearts and Minds | Heartwiring with Robert Perez

Do you think it’s possible to change someone’s mind on social and political issues?

In this deeply divided, polarized political situation we find ourselves in, while it may seem impossible to some.

But to Robert Perez, change is possible, and it’s only a matter of time.

And it does not involve yelling, or telling, or shaming, or outing.

As Robert says, it requires listening and understanding someone’s values, experiences, and emotional needs.

Robert acknowledges that it’s hard work, and yet it’s worth it because change is possible and it’s worth it.

Robert Perez, the Chief Exploration Officer at Wonder Strategies for Good, has been crafting strategic communications for social justice and progressive organizations for over 30 years. He’s been equipping people to arrive at a shared understanding of the solutions that make progressive social change happen.

In this episode, Robert shares his superpower of Heartwiring – the ability to identify the emotions, identity, lived experiences, values and beliefs of others whose support you need, and then craft messages that untie the psychological knots that people find themselves in.

As Robert explains, where there’s a little daylight between those factors, between what someone has been told to believe and what they’ve experienced and what they feel, that’s the space where change is possible.

“Heartwired” is a strategy guide that Robert and his colleague, Amy Simon, wrote in 2017 to help change makers better understand the audiences they are working with and how to build stories and messages that invite them to engage differently in the issues at heart.

Former FBI Hostage Negotiator, Chris Voss, (author, “Never Split the Difference”) talks about the value of “tactical empathy” to show the other person you understand what’s in their head and the rationale behind their actions.

Robert’s Heartwiring approach takes this further and acknowledges what’s in person’s heart, and entrusts them to use their values and experiences to make a different choice.

In this episode, Robert answers the following questions:
- How do you change someone’s mind?
- How do you communicate with someone with different political views than you?
- What are the factors that change someone’s position?
- What is the role of empathy in political discourse?

My favorite quote from the episode: “We equip people to arrive at a shared understanding of the solutions that will move us forward.”

Rather than telling someone what to think, Robert is entrusting the other person to think differently once they have been recognized and understood.

What I know to be true about the episode: I love how Robert’s superpower is a combination of what several guests have talked about, from Corinna Calhoun’s “Rewriting Inner Narratives” and Kevin Jones’ “Curiosity,” to Nicholas Whitaker’s “Art of Listening” and Asli Aker’s “Awareness,” this feels like the Justice League or the Avengers where multiple guests can come together and activate their superpowers for a better world.

What I learned from the episode: Relearning is learning, right? If Robert can go into focus group after focus group, interview after interview, survey after survey, and have to steep in some deeply narrow-minded and hateful rhetoric, and come away still believing that change is possible and these people are redemptive and worthy of love, I should be able to have love, empathy, compassion, and patience for those who hold very different opinions as I do.

Resources mentioned in the episode:
- Robert’s company: Wonder: Strategies for Good https://wonderforgood.com/

- Heartwired for Change – a strategy guide for making change: https://heartwiredforchange.com/

- “Caste: The Origins of Our Discontents” by Isabel Wilkerson https://bookshop.org/p/books/caste-op...

- “The Whole-Brain Child” by Daniel J. Siegel and Tina Payne Bryson https://bookshop.org/p/books/the-whol...

Music in this episode created by Ian Kastner.

"What Do You Know To Be True?" is a series of conversations where I speak with interesting people about their special talent or superhero power and the meaningful impact it has on others. The intention is to learn more about their experience with their superpower, so that we can learn something about the special talent in each of us which allows us to connect more deeply with our purpose and achieve our potential.

For more information about the podcast or to check out more episodes, go to: https://whatdoyouknowtobetrue.com/

"What Do You Know To Be True?" is hosted by Roger Kastner, is a production of Three Blue Pens, and is recorded on the ancestral lands of the Duwamish and Suquamish people. To discover the ancestral lands of the indigenous people whose land you may be on, go to: https://native-land.ca/